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Franky(OD)

Online Poker officially banned in the United States

43 posts in this topic

The FBI has cracked down on online poker and PokerStars, Full Tilt,and Absolute Poker have offically been shut down and company executes charged with fraud and money laundering, as an avid online poker playin im really freakin ticked!!!! over my two year online poker career I'd say i'm about exactly even when it comes to profit I've won a couple 12 dollar 180 person tournaments and raked in $600 dollars each time. I'm really gonna miss it :-(

RIP PokerStars

Link for proof:

http://thehill.com/blogs/hillicon-valley/technology/156429-fbi-shuts-down-online-poker-sites

Anyone else have an opinion on this or also like playing Online Poker like myself?

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how is it fraud if they actually pay you? I bet their just mad that its a loophole to the whole Native American Reservation thing, and how only they're allowed (by law) to own and operate a casino in the USA

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US federal law states that it is illegal for a company to run an online poker website for money; this does not affect your ability to play online poker whatsoever.

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look up the news ancient, it DOES affect the ability to play online poker I just tried to deposit money into my account and it wont let me the websites have been SHUT DOWN, so yeah even though it was always illegal you could still play because the sites were ran abroad, all the websites that do still let u play will probably very soon be closing their doors to all US players

Edited by Franky(OD)

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Online poker is illegal in the US. Banks refused to process the transactions from the poker sites. Poker sites then created fake companies to launder the money. That is fraud.

Basically billions of dollars that Americans were using for online poker have been seized/frozen.

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but hell Ancient, I do hope your right if you can find proof of a website that is still open to US players and would let you deposit money from a US bank and withdraw money after winning safely and legally please enlighten me

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i doubt that facebook poker is illegal now, im pretty sure its just all poker thats actually for real money

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So what, you don't think these multi-billion dollar companies are going to relocate their server farm to another country? Yes, they were committing fraud by bypassing detection systems via outsourcing deposit systems, however this "downtime" you're experiencing in the U.S. is only temporary.

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alright well let me know when and if u find out of a relocated server, im sure another host is just dieing and willing to risk getting charged with fraud and laundering by the US government when they can just include players from all the different countries in the world

Edited by Franky(OD)

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So what, you don't think these multi-billion dollar companies are going to relocate their server farm to another country? Yes, they were committing fraud by bypassing detection systems via outsourcing deposit systems, however this "downtime" you're experiencing in the U.S. is only temporary.

What the fuck are you talking about? None of these companies have a physical presence in the US. Online poker is ILLEGAL in the US. All of the companies are just going to block ALL US IP's and save themselves the trouble of going through something like this. A lot of these people are going to be taken into custody/indicted soon.

EDIT: http://www.justice.gov/usao/nys/pressreleases/April11/scheinbergetalindictmentpr.pdf

Edited by RuDeBoI

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thank you RB

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Even if they were to move their servers to a foreign country, they wouldn't allow IP's from USA.

The Pirate Bay, a free torrent site, located in Switzerland, can be accessed by US citizens. The government have tried to put an end to their "illegal" torrenting and numerous times failed because, duh, their in a different country, and their laws are different from ours. So go figure, TPB is still fighting to keep US users accessing it, and the gov. is not for it at all. I wouldn't be surprised if soon all incoming IP's to there are blocked.

Thats the only thing about that US law shit. Moving it to a foreign country might make it legal, but as far as US citizens using it, I'm pretty sure your ISP's would be all over keepin an eye out for you.

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On November 27, 2009, Department of the Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben S. Bernanke announced a six month delay, until June 1, 2010, for required compliance with the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act of 2006 (UIGEA). The move blocks regulations to implement the legislation which requires the financial services sector to comply with ambiguous and burdensome rules in an attempt to prevent unlawful Internet gambling transactions.

On July 28, 2010, the House Financial Services Committee passed H.R. 2267 by a vote of 41-22-1. The bill would legalize and regulate online poker in the United States.[15][16]

In September 2010, the Washington State Supreme Court upheld a law making playing poker online a felony.[17]

On April 15, 2011, the Federal Bureau of Investigation shut down three major poker sites, Full Tilt Poker, Poker Stars, and Absolute Poker. The a grand jury has charged 11 defendants, including the founders of the poker sites, with bank fraud, money laundering, and violating gambling laws. The prosecutors are claiming that the sites tricked and bribed U.S. banks to receive profits from online gambling, an act that violated UIGEA.[18]

"Is the recent US legislation a ban of online poker?"

Very simply put, "NO!!!". Where did the misguided suggestion that the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act is in any shape or form an "online poker ban" come from? Most likely, it is the result of the mainstream media doing a horrendous job of covering the story.

The entire legislative process for this bill has been a disgrace to our government and should have received nationwide outrage and extensive media coverage. Instead, newspapers and cable news channels glossed over the subject with headlines like, "Online Gambling Made Illegal" or "Senate Decides to Outlaw Online Gaming".

The preceding headlines are an embarrassment to honest reporting and are fundamentally wrong in their language. Online gambling has not been outlawed despite the media's inaccuracies. I'd like you to keep in mind a few important points about this bill as a poker player. It would be nice if the media outlets would do the same:

1. FALSE: The UIGEA bans online poker. In fact, the bill never even mentions online poker. It doesn't single out poker, blackjack, roulette, or any other skill or casino game. Many organizations, including the Poker Players Alliance, are lobbying in Washington to gain an exemption for poker from the bill.

Those sensible enough to listen will realize that poker is a skill game and couldn't be more different than casino games played against the house or sports betting firms acting as quasi-legal bookies.

2. FALSE: The bill makes it a crime to play poker or any other casino game online. Read that last point again: it isn't illegal to play online poker. The legislation passed never targets the individual player and was never intended to. The US government doesn't care enough to throw people in prison for playing $5 Sit 'n Goes.

The bill doesn't outline any penalty for players or ban gameplay and it never will. In fact, in the words of 25-year legal analyst and Cardplayer columnist Allyn Jaffrey Shulman, "the legal landscape of online gaming has not changed...the new bill does not make online gaming illegal." What does the bill actually do? Read on.

3. TRUE: This legislation bans US banks from working with international gambling sites, something that has already been voluntary practice for years. That's what this legislation is about - banking. It aims to decrease online gambling by making it unlawful for US banks to send money directly to online gambling operations.

What is so ridiculous about all this is that almost all domestic credit cards and banks voluntarily stopped doing business with gambling sites years ago! Have you ever tried to deposit money at a poker site using your credit card? Most likely the transaction was promptly blocked by your card-issuing bank.

Thus, your next option is to utilize third-party payment services that are used by the poker room. Amazingly, online poker has already come a long way since the UIGEA was enacted. Several poker rooms now accept direct checking account and even credit card deposits through their built-in cashiers. Check our

eChecks and US credit card poker pages for poker rooms that support these simple methods of deposit.

4. TRUE: US Courts have ruled that the Wire Act of 1961 does not apply to poker or online gambling. The Department of Justice would like to believe that the antiquated Wire Act still applies today, making all forms of betting illegal online. In fact, district courts have ruled the opposite as recently as 2001 when a group of US bettors brought a lawsuit against a major credit company. They refused to pay their bills for gambling transactions and cited the Wire Act as their reasoning, claiming that they should not be held liable since the online gambling sites were committing a crime.

The judge emphatically ruled against the bettors, citing the irrelevance of a 40-year old law that only applies to accepting interstate telephone sports bets. Perhaps most pleasing was the judge's statement that the spirit of the Wire Act does not apply to modern-day internet gambling. Another fact to consider is that there has never been a single arrest in this country based simply on gambling online.

5. TRUE: The motivation of this legislation was not based on morals. Corrupt Senators like Bill Frist and John Kyl would like you to believe that they forced this legislation through to protect us from ourselves - already a massive destruction of civil liberties. They make quotes comparing online gambling to crack. "Click the mouse and lose your house," was one such quote of rhetorical nonsense. They'd love for you to believe that they're simply restricting our choices because, left to our own devices, we're unprincipled and sinful. Unfortunately, even that "noble" cause wasn't their motivation.

It's all about money. International gambling sites pay no US taxes and have no reason to. Our government doesn't receive a slice of the pie so they decided to just try to stop the money flow altogether. Instead of legalizing and taxing online gambling like forward thinking countries in Europe, a few special interests have thrust our country into another tailspin.

Do you think that I'm just biased? Consider this: the bill carves out special exemptions for online bets placed on horse racing and state lotteries. Yes, you read that right: gambling that is taxed is completely legal. Is throwing away your money on horse racing or quick picks less wrong than playing online poker? Apparently, to people like Bill Frist morality has a price.

"What should I take away from all this?"

The most important concept of this article is that online poker is still not a crime. The Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act, passed in late September 2006, is not an online poker ban. The bill is entirely a banking transaction and has nothing to do with the individual player. Going even further, it doesn't even change the murky legal status of online gambling. It does not set punishments for placing bets and it doesn't target poker players. You can still play poker online and that still isn't illegal for all the reasons I outlined above.

"Why are poker sites shutting down?"

Unfortunately, all of the publicly traded online poker rooms have shut their doors to U.S. players. Again, this has less to do with the actual legislation and more to do with money. Companies like 888, PartyGaming, and Sportingbet have stockholders to answer to. Investors will be extremely leery to do business with a company that appears to be doing something risky on the surface. The move is intended to cover their butts at the next Board meeting. Consider that the majority of privately owned online poker sites have stuck around whereas every publicly traded company has bowed out of the US market.

Edited by Ancient

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the actual document from the new york attorney general or some random internet website?

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I am dumb founded by this move. From what I have seen people haven't been getting ripped off. All of those companies have commercials.

The only thing I can think of is (correct me if I am wrong) taxes weren't being paid to the government on players winnings.

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yeah but Spike all of the commercials aired in the US specifically say "This is not a gambling website" because pokerstars, fulltilt, etc. all have free games where u play with "play chips" or they have freeroll tournaments where u can win seats in other tournaments and stuff, the commercials don't support adding real money into your account and playing with it

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Taxes were never collected on winnings from any of the online poker sites. On top of that the companies ran their money through

other countries banks which becomes almost impossible to regulate. Our government in the US along with lobbyists and casinos

want the money to be taxed and regulated.

you can expect the sites to be down for a few weeks before they figure out how to tax/regulate the money and then legalize online gambling.

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This law is garbage....With the way everything is ran through multiple media venues it should be to each persons discretion whether or not they choose to participate in paid poker/online gambling events. The government is just worried they might miss out on their share....EFF them...they R^&*e Pillage and Plunder our pocket books enough ^_-

Gambling is an addiction. Much like tobacco. It ruins lives. Call 1-800-SELF-CONTROL for help... ;)

yea...I am opinionated about this....after all I work at a casino.....

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True, the government might be very concerned that a lot of US money is flowing outward in a manner that they can't tax. As well they should be.

A lot of you are pretty quick to say things like "Oh they're just doing this so they can get their hands on some of our money". Well, yes? In case some of you have forgotten, the United States is still in a very serious economic state, their role as the center of international economy is almost certainly coming to a swift end. Your government needs revenue in order to re-stabilize your country's condition, and applying pressure on US citizens to spend their cash on things the government can tax is a very excellent, and reasonable, start.

Don't be so hasty to point the finger at something...

Edited by Terra

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Hasty to point the finger yes....This government wastes so much money on unnecessary ventures....the focus needs to be drawn back to this country and not on other countries. we over extend ourselves in international affairs spending money we do not have. So until they correct the very poor judgement in our spending then yes I will be very negative about the amount of tax this country applies to us. I am not a political genious and I do not follow it in anyway but it is easy to see that they spend too much money. The system needs to be corrected....

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Proxy through some shitty country like France, and all will be ok.

Im hoping to open my swiss bank account this year >.<

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In case some of you have forgotten, the United States is still in a very serious economic state, their role as the center of international economy is almost certainly coming to a swift end.

Whenever I visit America I notice how many luxuries the majority of the population take for granted. Maybe that'll change in the next ten years, eh? The downside, of course, will be listening to all of them complain when shit like this starts happening more often.

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what in canada can you not do that americans can?? atleast you can gamble online freely! DAMN! and seriously you sound pretty ignorant man basically calling everyone in the US whiney bitches "listening to all of us complain", and that article you posted was clearly wrong ive downloaded all the poker clients and none of them are accepting US players anymore, so obviously YES this did prohibit US players from playing online poker

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Not sure why people are freaking out about this, or especially surprised. To my understanding online poker/gambling has always been illegal to some degree. They are just now starting to enforce it, which I see no problem with. Regardless, I'm not surprised, nor upset.

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